**Reminder:** Do not participate in threads linked here. If you do, you may be banned from both subreddits. --- Title: Chase bank wire fraud Body: > Chase fraud please help > Nyc > I was involved in a fraudulent wire for 19k and need to know of i should take this serious like am I going to be arrested should I just not respond I need advice > My mans asked me for my acc and routing number said bread going be there > We emptied the account > But usually they just close your account and that’s it > Now 2 months later I have this letter > I didn’t sign anything I simply gave my acc and routing numbers and money was there This bot was created to capture original threads and is not affiliated with the mod team. [Concerns? Bugs?](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=GrahamCorcoran) | [Laukopier 2.1](https://github.com/GrahamCorcoran/Laukopier)


>So let me get this straight: >* Your "boy" wired money from some random stranger's account into your account. Presumably, this was an unauthorized transfer or the result of some sort of scam. >* After the money arrived in your account, you spent it all. >* Now Chase figured this out, and is coming after you Do I have that right? >Yeah


He's going to be a great witness for the prosecution


Which, it seems, is what the police may offer them if they manage to talk to an attorney and cooperate.


His last comment is "You have snap or some I would like to tail your bets" in a sports betting sub. Clearly money is not an issue for "my mans" so hopefully he lawyers up


Did you see the following comment? I burst out laughing.


Oh my god someone get Jason Mendoza off Reddit




The best part is every reply has a different interpretation of what “my mans” means and all of them are wrong.


Every LA commenter sounds like my mom trying to watch a tiktok.


“So that’s your friend?” No, mom. That’s a random person from the internet


“Oh. So how do you know them?”


"I'm happy you're at least meeting people."


How do all of you know my mom?


I waved at a driver because they let me in the other day and my 5 yo asked me what their name was.


Lmao kids are a hoot


For Maximum Mom (tm) you need to call it *a tick tock video*


This is what I would have called it... I'm 30...


In my 40s here... what are we supposed to be calling tiktok videos? Tokes?


Tic Tacs


Please refer to it as "watchin' the tok."


The tick tocks


"Is that on the online?"


There is a grandpa at our barn that says, “get on the Google machine,” when he tells someone to go google something lol.


That one clock app


I’m a mom. I call them the tickety toks. Of course, I’m not a *regular* mom - I’m a *Cool Mom*! /s in case anyone’s not seen Mean Girls.


I like to switch it up with Tic-Tacs or something else close but in infuriating every once in a while “ARE YALL WATCHING THAT TIC-TAC-TOE BUSINESS AGAIN?” My tween and teen sons enjoy my humor very much.


Huh, today is the day I'm so old I didn't realize how old I was


So, this is what being old feels like. ... I don't like it.


Shit, that's what I call it


Comment of the year right here


I am a mom who uses TikTok and now wonder if my kid thinks I'm lame.


> I am a mom ~~who uses TikTok and now wonder if~~ my kid thinks I'm lame. As a fellow parent I fixed it for you.




oh my god mom no one writes like that anymore


Yes But the key is to embrace it. Like saying "My drip is on fleek, no cap."


I told a student that he could "yeet people's minds with his dab vocabulary." And then giggled for the next 10 minutes.


Gah I love messing with them. 8th graders, and my highbrow humor is lost on them. 🤷


And when they beg you to stop, tell them to cope.


Seethe, even.


Your kid will think you’re lame no matter what


Flair please


I’m going to be honest. I’ve read all of it twice and I’m still confused. Here’s my best guess: Original Poster has a friend that gets other peoples’ account and routing numbers and them sends this money to his friends, in this case op. Op believes that generally Chase just closes these accounts once drained, or does he mean the “gang” sends money to a new account which they drain and then close?


Your interpretation is correct. OP’s friend has hacked someone else’s bank account and is using OP as a mule. OP was under the impression that banks close accounts after suspected fraud and that’s the end of it. Victim is compensated, fraudster gets away with it. But this situation isn’t suspected fraud. This is actual fraud.


Is this one of those situations where we almost feel sorry for the criminal because they are just too stupid to understand what they are doing?


Unless they think money is being conjured from nowhere, they know that at a minimum they are robbing from the bank. Regardless on your feelings towards banks, I think we can all agree that stealing from them is at least illegal.


I don't know. That guys whole post makes me think he might be incapable of really thinking the whole thing through.


"Can you edit your post to include your location and a clear description of the problem without leaving out details?" *Nyc* "Done"


I was literally laughing out loud when I read that. Like this dude seriously thinks he explained this whole situation clearly.


"I have this letter" 😂


> Nyc Looks like OP has 3 letters


I'll admit I gave the "done" comment an upvote because it made me laugh so much.


I'm getting some real Jason Mendoza and Pillboi vibes from this OP.


“Every time I have a problem, I just commit felony wire fraud. Boom, right away, I have a different problem.”




Oh, dip!






Especially since what we’re reading was after they “edited for clarity”. They truly believe this is a clear, concise retelling of what happened.


I mean it's pretty clear what's going on isn't it. The OP's friend is in the business of somehow fraudulently getting funds out of other people's accounts into accounts the OP controls, and then they withdraw the funds and close the account the funds are dumped into. Now the bank has caught on and sent the OP a letter and he's (rightfully) worried.


I am finding this whole thing hilarious. But deep down, I know I should be worried for this guy.


Well it’s good thing detectives and the courts are generally well known for recognizing learning disabilities or mental illness and giving appropriate treatment during the interrogation and sentencing phases, so this will go fine for LAOP /s


Honestly he just talks like someone from South London. It’s not a disability, I swear. Source: am from South London but went to university and bare fixed up mans language


That last sentence is such beautiful proof that you are, in fact, from Sowf Lundun.


Lotta linguistic cross pollination occurring due to drill/grime/hip hop on both sides of the pond inspiring each other.


Actually there are a lot of people that think that money is exactly conjured from nowhere. Two people at my last job would have argued vehemently with you about this. Pretty much anyone that wants to go back to a gold standard thinks this, and I bet that the belief has expanded dramatically with the popularity of cryptocurrencies, because it's part of the common messaging enforcing them. When you add in that a lot of the opinion commentary in the media will imply or outright state this when talking about policies like bank bailouts or covid unemployment relief and... yeah, there is actually a really big chance that LAOP thinks that "money is being conjured from nowhere" is a pretty accurate statement.


It doesn’t come from nowhere! It comes from that special printer that goes brrrrr. Duh!


Only the Federal Reserve is allowed to do it, though. Not even /s


Well it does technically come from nowhere, trouble is, only the Federal Reserve has the right to conjure money from nowhere. And they won't just like give you some maaaaan.


Putting to the side for the moment that cryptocurrencies have absolutely nothing backing them and therefore are just as much fiat currencies as the US Dollar, Euro, etc. I doubt that LAOP has such strong opinions on monetary policy. I'm more apt to believe that they just think it is a victimless crime, like punching someone in the dark.


Cryptocurrencies have far less backing them than the US Dollar or Euro. Both the US and the EU have a military protecting them.


The global oil market is settled and denominated in USD mostly as well.


You haven’t heard of the Bitcoin Army?


If a tree falls in a forest but it’s FDIC insured, is it still a fell-ony?


Uh, yea, in that sense yes, the Fed literally just conjures money from nowhere.


I’m not sure I see anything from LAOP that indicates such a deep logical understanding of something like cause-and-effect.


I personally do feel sorry for them being stupid, but there’s no doubt in my mind that they know that they’re stealing- and that they’ve done it before. They’re smart enough to use the term “bank fraud,” but when an innocent third party’s money shows up in your bank account and you withdraw it and keep it, it’s stealing. The fact that they have had the experience “the bank usually just closes the account” is pretty much an admission that this isn’t the first time. If I had to guess, I’d say that they started out stealing smaller amounts, and when it worked so easily and without consequences, they got greedy and went for $19,000. I thought banks had systems in place for flagging this kind of history before they let you open an account. I just hope Chase follows up on this. Like another commenter mentioned, it doesn’t matter how you feel about big banks; stealing from them is still wrong. Illegal, too.


Yes and no. LAOP is clearly not an intelligent person, but you don’t have to smart to know stealing is wrong.


Yes, they are absolutely getting duped by the real fraudster. This guy didn’t steal the bank account, he was a mule and the fall guy. Now “my mans” is free to keep stealing bank accounts.


I mean OK but he knowingly participated in a criminal scheme. He just didn't realize how much risk he was taking.


The best thing you can do to someone you are conning is make them break the law. Now, when they realize *they* are being conned, they will be reluctant to go to the police because at worst they are going to take the fall, and at best they are going to be spending a lot of time and money working on a deal to get immunity in exchange for their testimony. Their "mans" tells them that he's done this many times in the past. He'll deposit X amount of money into LAOPs account, LAOP or the scammer will withdrawl all them money, leaving the account at zero, the two will split it, Chase will investigate but discover that it was not LAOP who deposited the money, Chase will close the account. The End. We all know in reality all of that happens, but instead of "The End," it's detectives Johnson and Johnson show up at their door with an arrest warrant after they've already gathered enough financial evidence from the bank and credit cards to pin this on LAOP, and when LAOP give's "their mans" name, it's gonna come back as fake.


I'm sure but it's like if you were trying to hire a hitman and got an undercover cop. Yeah you were tricked but you were still trying to have someone killed


I'm not saying they are innocent, I'm saying that the likelihood that two morons hatched this plan and got to this stage is less likely than one intelligent criminal turned a moron into a criminal with the promise of a large, quick payday with almost no work, and then left them holding the bag after the crime. LAOP can be both a criminal and a victim.


Except that OP did it multiple times, and knows it was fraud.


Nope they knew exactly what was going on the whole time. They full well knew the money was the result of something very sketchy and totally illegal. They were 100% complicit in this crime.


Exactly -- I don't get why folks are excusing this. His answers in LA and other subs shows s/he knows what they did, and it isn't the first time they did it. They say they spent all 19K since late December. And, it is someone's money. Probably a confused elderly person's money.




I just love the fact they posted to /r/Scams about their difficulties *carrying out* a scam.


They posted the actual letter and then in the comments said "yes this is fraud" Chase is going to eat these people for lunch.


they're definitely not getting a lawyer either if they were dumb enough to get this far


Yeah but *bread going be there*


"can i pay you with ACH transfer from someone else's account?"


To me that post reads like they're worried that the letter notifying them of the fraud investigation is a scam.


Lol but he readily admits he was part of a fraudulent scheme I feel like he’s one step away from going to Chase and saying, “Hey Chase, you’re not holding up your end. When I’ve committed fraud before you usually just close the account, what gives with the letter??” This guys may be getting a reality check soon.




Thanks, I guess it doesn’t really add much to the LAOPs story, or lack of one for that matter, but it seems like contacting an attorney would be a great idea. Maybe his mans could hook him up with some digis for a good lawyer.


It seems like throwing his crime partner under the bus is his best route but he/she might not be willing to do that.


Looks like a standard affidavit declaring that the transactions in question (which aren't actually listed on the form; it's just a blank form for the "defrauded" customer to fill out with the details) were fraudulent and performed without the customer's authorisation, and that the customer had no knowledge of or involvement with then and received no benefit from them. I've filled out similar affidavits when disputing fraudulent credit card transactions in the past.




I think we are all interested.


sounds about right. some scammers recruit money mules to move money out of victims' accounts. Usually, they recruit young, low-income mules in the US with bank accounts.


I'm thinking it's "some dude." Not even "my friend."


“My mans” is someone you know, usually a friend. It’s AAVE


People are having the exact same argument in this thread with little more success. There is something very amusing about the idea of sheltered redditors finally actually meeting urban people and just assuming they're all gay.


*But usually they just close your account and that’s it* Either LAOP did this before or they were told by the person they gave their account info to that nothing bad would happen and they believed them.


I'd put fraudulently acquired money on that LAOP has done this before


i have a sneaking suspicion the banks might track this kind of thing


No no, next time just use someone else's social like your kid's or something.


You could probably get a friend's kid's social for like $400.


*~~Baskin Robbins~~ Chase always finds out* But seriously, I think the only answers that LAOP needs is "Yes, you need to be worried, you need a defense lawyer familiar with fraud, if you don't use some/all of your illicitly gained funds to get a good lawyer you may be turbofucked." I'm not familiar with how Chase fraud department operates (or how bank fraud departments operate in general) but I have a hunch that like Walmart they know when you're committing fraud and wait for it to cross a certain line where it's worth their time and money to bring charges, and LAOP just pranced across that line with a "big score."


Macy's, Macy's waits for you to steal a federal amount, then offers to arrest you or put it on your Macy's card at 25%. Source- I worked for them for several years and watched a few managers get arrested/let go with massive debt


Target the same


I'm a dumb man, is that for reals? "Hey, do you want to go to jail? Oooorrrrr... have you heard about our store card?"


That's basically it. It's "Hey you've now committed a felony. Would you like us to call the cops or can I put this on your Macy's card"


>if you don't use some/all of your illicitly gained funds to get a good lawyer you may be turbofucked. yeah i don't see $18k worth of legal defense even doing too much for an $18k dead-to-rights felony if they didn't waste it, which they definitely did. praying the local prisons are overcrowded will get them about as far


The expensive lawyer isn't to get you off, it's to lessen the punishment. Go from 10-15 years in federal penitentary, to 3 years probation and mandatory "how not to steal" classes, or something like that, [like rich people get](https://ag.ny.gov/press-release/2019/donald-j-trump-pays-court-ordered-2-million-illegally-using-trump-foundation). > The settlement also included mandatory training requirements the training requirements were classes that amounted to "how not to embezzle funds"


“Hey man, don’t worry! If the bank catches us stealing *thousands of dollars*, they’ll just close the account. They’re pretty chill about all that. What’s that? Fraud? Grand theft? Nah, those aren’t things that exist. So….gimme that account number.”


Yeah, my read on it is that they were told they would appear to be the "victim" to the bank


I would believe that MAYBE, except they spent the entire 19K in about a month, and started spending as soon a sit hit their account. They've posted this in several subs.


Oh I do not believe they are actually a real victim. I believe they were told they would appear to be an innocent victim so they would believe they are safe


My guess is that they're a super native teenager who was fed the 'but usually they just close the account' line in order to coerce them into being the mule. So yeah they were probably misled about the risk this scam entailed, but (1) that doesn't make it any less illegal and immoral & (2) even a child should know that eventually SOMEONE would look into where the money went and who owned that account. I feel bad for them because they seem like a straight idiot who was roped in without understanding what was going on, but they intentionally and willingly participated in fraud, so they're definitely looking at some (deserved) jail time. I wonder if they even know the main scammer irl or if they got pulled into an overseas operation who just needed a domestic go-between.


Everybody jumping to conclusions here but what if LAOP is not a very stupid human but actually is a very smart bird and thought his owner was promising him literal bread?


Too much bread is bad for birds, LAOP is screwed either way!


That oddly explains the grammar.


>I'm going to say you should be concerned. That is 50% based on grammar and spelling, plus fact organization. This was my favorite LA comment.


As George Carlin said, "Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are stupider than that." Source: https://quotepark.com/quotes/781444-george-carlin-think-of-how-stupid-the-average-person-is-and-rea/


Pedantic nitpicking: Half the people are more stupid than the *median* stupidity (by definition), not the *mean* stupidity (which is indeed what's easier to estimate). Since many human characteristics follow a Guassian distribution, it's plausible to expect the median and the mean to coincide, assuming stupidity is measured in a way that actually follows such a distribution. But other characteristics - e.g. "number of legs" - don't have means and averages that coincide. *way* fewer than half the people have below-average number of legs. tl;dr: While this may be true for stupidity, in general it's misleading.




Better call noted bird law expert Charlie Kelly.


What say you and I go toe-to-toe on bird law and see who comes out the victor?


“Very Smart Bird” is good flare.


My personal favorite interaction: > Can you please edit your post to include a location and a clear description of the situation, not leaving out details? > Done Like, no, buddy, it's definitely not done.




"a clear description of the situation, not leaving out details"


Wait, stealing shitloads of other people's money is illegal?


But LAOP didn't sign anything! That makes it just like picking up money lying in the street! See, normally, when you rob a place, you sign a note and leave it at the scene verifying that this was, indeed, a crime. Since nothing like that happened, LAOP gets to keep the money!


Unless you sign a notice that you are committing a crime and have it witnessed by at least two unrelated persons and notarized, you legally cannot be convicted of a crime. That would be *ipso facto* entrapment infringing on your penumbra rights without your consent.


At what amount does a “load” of money turn into a “shitload”? We should define these things.


One shitload is 0.03 metric fucktons. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns. Please do not contact the local bot murderer.*


What's the conversion between metric and imperial fucktons?


That changes regularly, you have to look it up. I go to FASDAQ. Right now it's 1mft to .834ift


Well, it's definitely more than a "buttload".




Not just felonies. **Federal** felonies!


Indeed. His comments are being downvoted but my mans the ideal LAOP. Very responsive, not evasive, and answers questions directly. Definitely not the typical criminal lying to themselves and expecting others to play along.


It reads like this is written by Jason Mendoza from The Good Place.


I absolutely read it in his voice!


"your honor, I knew my friend was going to transfer $19k of stolen money to my bank account but all I did was give him my bank account information, he did the rest. I am innocent."


*And most importantly, I didn’t sign anything.*


everyone knows you can't commit a crime unless you sign something.


And I started braking!


Yes hello I have committed a serious crime, and so I guess my question is: was that cool?


My friend called me and asked to use my garage. I gave him the key and he told me a car was going to be there. I don’t know who’s car it was but I helped him part it out and we split the money. I moved the next week but now the original owner of the car found my new address and is wanting it back. Usually they just give up when they find out I moved. Should I just ignore them or do I need a lawyer? /s


Yeah, but you wouldn't download a car. He probably just downloaded the money.


Ah , not signing anything , the one trick that DA's and prosecutors hate.


LAOP seems like one of those people you occasionally hear about that can't understand why their checking account is overdrawn if they still have checks in their checkbook. Their PD is probably going to just tell LAOP to shut up, and only answer yes/no to any questions in court. Any attempt at complete sentences is only going to make whatever situation they are in even worse.


One thing I learned over the course of growing up is that there's a certain percentage of society who's frighteningly, mind-bogglingly stupid. Like the kind of person that makes you wonder how they ever leave their house and go anywhere without dying. Prosecutors *love* when these people decide to become criminals because they make for slam-dunk convictions, and other (smarter) criminals love them too because they can be framed for a whole lotta stuff that they can barely comprehend.


The greatest argument for lead abatement imo.


But LAOP strikes me as the type that wouldn’t listen and would spout off and ruin their case.


What gets me is his post asking what people's college sports bet are a few hours later


Nah, that makes sense. They realized they're in deep shit with Chase and need to come up with $19k, and fast.


Someone needs to tell LAOP that Chase isn't like the local loan shark, they don't suddenly stop asking questions if they receive enough "I'm sorry" money.


Ever since I started working at a bank, banking BOLAs have become my favorite. I know the exact kind of person LAOP is. They're the kind of person who walked into my branch today and answered the question about employment with "Oh, I used to work at Burger King a while back, but now I just deal drugs." They're the kind of person who, as small talk, told me that they had just snorted 3 Xanax in the parking lot. They're the kind of person who overdraws their account at the ATM right outside the bank and then disputes the charges because "someone stole their wallet", and gets mad when we pull the camera footage.


I refuse to believe this isn’t a Good Place fanfic from the point of view of Jason or Donkey Doug.


Jason still has [my favorite line ever uttered on television](https://youtu.be/1-yzfjvu-n4), and it was one word. > Janet: Jason, do you want me to be your wife? > Jason: Yeah! > Janet: And I want you to be my husband. > Jason: Tight.


No, this isn’t nearly silly enough to be a Donkey Doug scam. It needs alligators or axe body spray or the Jacksonville Jaguars.


And a Molotov cocktail - the solution to all of life’s problems!


I mean....there still could be if you want to get rid of the physical bank branch near you, it erases all the data right? Seems to be line with OP's thinking.


Is it just me or is this easily enough details for a court to identify LAOP? Doesn't exactly help that they posted a picture of the letters earlier and then confessed that this was indeed fraud that they committed.


Nah, it’s cool my mans. All they gotta do is delete their account and prosecutors can’t prove nothing. /s


It's probably fine. I hear that when you post proof of your crimes to the internet they just shut off your account with your ISP and you have to make a new one.




>usually i feel like a history of doing wire fraud both hasn't taught them very much & will look bad in a courtroom


>I'm going to say you should be concerned. That is 50% based on grammar and spelling, plus fact organization. This comment. Gold.


I also enjoyed how LAOP replied "yeah" to this comment: So let me get this straight: * Your "boy" wired money from some random stranger's account into your account. Presumably, this was an unauthorized transfer or the result of some sort of scam. * After the money arrived in your account, you spent it all. * Now Chase figured this out, and is coming after you Do I have that right?


haha I just realized he said he spent it all. not sure how he thinks he's gonna get away with that one. money just magically showed up in his account one day and he spent it but is totally innocent because his friend put it there.


His friend put it there AND he didn’t sign anything so it was totally outta his control obviously lmao


I like how they framed all of that in the worst interpretation possible, and OP just said "yeah." Like, "yeah I've just spent 19k that I knew was stolen from a stranger, yeah I let the thieves transfer the money into my account, yeah I had advance warning this was all going down, yeah the bank caught on..."


This reads like 4chan greentext... >Be me >live in NYC > commit 19K felony >what do?


> Can you please edit your post to include a location and a clear description of the situation, not leaving out details? And while you are at it, can you email all of these details to the FBI and to Chase bank? kthxbai


Fun fact: kthxbye is an amazing feat of English abbreviation (and your rendition, kthxbai, more impressive still). It's a concatenation of three different abbreviations: 'k' stands for 'OK' (for which there's no accepted meaning, I think); 'thx' stands for "thanks"; and 'bye' stands for "goodbye", which is originally a distorted version of "godbwye" - an *abbrevation* of "God be with ye". So the 7 letter 'kthxbye' expands out to the six word sentence "OK, thanks, God be with you".


Oh no! Consequences! Anyway in other news...


I read that twice and still don't fully understand what he's trying to say


That feeling when two of the few words in your vocabulary are "wire" and "fraud".


Weird to see Jason Mendoza outside of Florida.




As someone that just had their credit card stolen.. fuck these people in particular.


Oh no, the entirety forseeable consequences on participating in a fraud scheme


This person sounds like the perfect scenario for "not competent to stand trial".


Is it legit to plead not guilty by reason or stupidity?


Your Honor, my client is a fucking idiot. Just dumb as rock. Cocker Spaniels have more sense and better grammar. I request a bad trial thingy.


Surely the best place to put this person too stupid not to commit felonies is back where they can commit more felonies.


On the flip side, he did commit a crime, but the portions of that crime that require skill and work were solely the doing of someone else. Based on this and his general everything, he may be too dumb to do anything but idly be made accomplice by other people. So long as he doesn’t seem inclined to violence we might just give him a coloring book and rest easy knowing he’ll be distracted for a while.


Being a willing accomplice to felonies doesn't seem like someone I want hanging around either.


I love LAOP's "yeah".


2 observations: First, I love that LAOP was dumb enough to post about this in THREE different subs. Second, my MIL is absolutely dumb and gullible enough to be LAOP. This exact situation is something my husband and I are just waiting for her to walk into one of these days (except with her "boyfriend" instead of a friend, aka the latest entity to romance scam her).